Hi Shwetha,
Its a good topic you have raised.
We call ourselves as Strategic Partners and at this situation you blame the company, I dont agree with you all.Is it that you just want to convince yourselves and say you are strategic partner when you actually restrict yourselves from not going deep into the fact and analyze the strategy of the top management.
If the Company feels that it can no more bear the expenses of manpower it surely takes good decision.
Let aside our soft natured and Humanity as a HR Professional, But be practical if the company has no enough funds do you think you can survive in the market by paying salaries to employees and with no Return On Investment.
Why do you deny the fact that even employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks. Why are you feeling bad if the reverse is happening to them take it in a positive way. Just spread a rumour that the company is not profitable and you will see by next payroll you would be calculating final settlements to atleast 50% of the employees.
Yes I admit that its recruitment costs but that should be planned well in advance backed by good mid and senior level management strategy
.
I hope I have not hurt the feelings of my friends and being more practical. You will understand this concept when you work for Small & Medium enterprises, where the management struggles to bear even simple overheads like staff parties, picnic or even administration costs like visiting cards.
Correct me if Im wrong But I want Shwetha to reply me.
Thanks
Shahed
From Qatar, Doha
2Its a good topic you have raised.
We call ourselves as Strategic Partners and at this situation you blame the company, I dont agree with you all.Is it that you just want to convince yourselves and say you are strategic partner when you actually restrict yourselves from not going deep into the fact and analyze the strategy of the top management.
If the Company feels that it can no more bear the expenses of manpower it surely takes good decision.
Let aside our soft natured and Humanity as a HR Professional, But be practical if the company has no enough funds do you think you can survive in the market by paying salaries to employees and with no Return On Investment.
Why do you deny the fact that even employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks. Why are you feeling bad if the reverse is happening to them take it in a positive way. Just spread a rumour that the company is not profitable and you will see by next payroll you would be calculating final settlements to atleast 50% of the employees.
Yes I admit that its recruitment costs but that should be planned well in advance backed by good mid and senior level management strategy
.
I hope I have not hurt the feelings of my friends and being more practical. You will understand this concept when you work for Small & Medium enterprises, where the management struggles to bear even simple overheads like staff parties, picnic or even administration costs like visiting cards.
Correct me if Im wrong But I want Shwetha to reply me.
Thanks
Shahed
From Qatar, Doha
Hi Swetha,
This is very burning issue. We need to take it very seriously.
Before sending out the employees every employer is saying that very common reason.i.e...
1. Your performance level is very poor.
Here is my question to all the HR people.
They are not performing well means why u have hired them into your organisation?
Is your selection wrong?
If it is right you are not a perfect selector.
Then you also need to go out along with those employees.
I am not criticizing the HR.Many MNC's having lot of rounds for an interview.Eventhough there is a lot of scarab material entering into the organization.
As said earlier one of our HR Mr. Bee why can't we take very talent persons at the time of recruitment only?
If we take the skilled person he can do the work of two skilled persons.
The productivity will be 1:2 ratios.
Conclusion:
Finally i want to say all the HR people either don't show the above reason while you are sending some 'X' or 'Y' from the organization or recruit the talent manpower.
Being a HR i should not blame the other HR.
Please don't take it seriously but if you feel that my perception is wrong just tell me .
Being a fresher i need to learn a lot from the senior persons like you.
Thanks & Regards
Uday
From India, Hyderabad
This is very burning issue. We need to take it very seriously.
Before sending out the employees every employer is saying that very common reason.i.e...
1. Your performance level is very poor.
Here is my question to all the HR people.
They are not performing well means why u have hired them into your organisation?
Is your selection wrong?
If it is right you are not a perfect selector.
Then you also need to go out along with those employees.
I am not criticizing the HR.Many MNC's having lot of rounds for an interview.Eventhough there is a lot of scarab material entering into the organization.
As said earlier one of our HR Mr. Bee why can't we take very talent persons at the time of recruitment only?
If we take the skilled person he can do the work of two skilled persons.
The productivity will be 1:2 ratios.
Conclusion:
Finally i want to say all the HR people either don't show the above reason while you are sending some 'X' or 'Y' from the organization or recruit the talent manpower.
Being a HR i should not blame the other HR.
Please don't take it seriously but if you feel that my perception is wrong just tell me .
Being a fresher i need to learn a lot from the senior persons like you.
Thanks & Regards
Uday
From India, Hyderabad
Hi Shwetha,
Hi Shahed,
Its a good topic you have raised.
Thanks for putting a comment on this...
We call ourselves as Strategic Partners and at this situation you blame the company, I don't agree with you all.Is it that you just want to convince yourselves and say you are strategic partner when you actually restrict yourselves from not going deep into the fact and analyze the strategy of the top management.
Firstly, I do agree with your valid point that we are Strategic partners ...and yes I must clarify that I am not blaming the company whereas I have raised that what made the top management deiced that we need to recruit manpower then after a couple of months suddenly cut on jobs as a cost cutting measure.......
If the Company feels that it can no more bear the expenses of manpower it surely takes good decision.
Good Decision is to fire any employee but on the grounds of Non performance.....I openly say that at times management also take wrong decision and when some subordinate try to give their view point ...it is usually termed as "Confrontation" ......It won't be wrong to say that at times our Risk Management strategies also fail.......Might it doesn't cause any harm to management but yes it is a genuine loss to employees who work hard but still left demotivated......
Let aside our soft natured and Humanity as a HR Professional, But be practical if the company has no enough funds do you think you can survive in the market by paying salaries to employees and with no Return On Investment.
Being Professional & Practical is very good but "HR" itself means Human Resources and it's setup in the company is not just for company but for employees well....HR people are also known as trust worthy people......HR acts as a bridge between the Management and Employees......
Why do you deny the fact that even employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks. Why are you feeling bad if the reverse is happening to them take it in a positive way. Just spread a rumour that the company is not profitable and you will see by next payroll you would be calculating final settlements to atleast 50% of the employees.
I agree with you on this point that "employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks" but in this situation HR do also take the hard ways to crack it off.....I am not criticizing HR Community but there are HR's who make false promises to fill the position and plays with an employee future.....Infact in this Website only you may find several issues relating to that......
Yes I admit that its recruitment costs but that should be planned well in advance backed by good mid and senior level management strategy
Thanks to you atleast you agree at some point......
.
I hope I have not hurt the feelings of my friends and being more practical. You will understand this concept when you work for Small & Medium enterprises, where the management struggles to bear even simple overheads like staff parties, picnic or even administration costs like visiting cards.
Correct me if Im wrong But I want Shwetha to reply me.
So Dear...I am not being hurt and hope that you also take this conversation in the right way.........But by way I must say that I used to work in the India's biggest Retail Chain but recently shifted to the mid sized MNC in Delhi...but my dear friend situation is the same........
Lastly, I must say that this issue is not to raise any comment on the any said strategy but it was posted to get different mindsets views on it...............
Thanks
Shahed
Thanks
Shweta Jaitly
From India, Coimbatore
Hi Shahed,
Its a good topic you have raised.
Thanks for putting a comment on this...
We call ourselves as Strategic Partners and at this situation you blame the company, I don't agree with you all.Is it that you just want to convince yourselves and say you are strategic partner when you actually restrict yourselves from not going deep into the fact and analyze the strategy of the top management.
Firstly, I do agree with your valid point that we are Strategic partners ...and yes I must clarify that I am not blaming the company whereas I have raised that what made the top management deiced that we need to recruit manpower then after a couple of months suddenly cut on jobs as a cost cutting measure.......
If the Company feels that it can no more bear the expenses of manpower it surely takes good decision.
Good Decision is to fire any employee but on the grounds of Non performance.....I openly say that at times management also take wrong decision and when some subordinate try to give their view point ...it is usually termed as "Confrontation" ......It won't be wrong to say that at times our Risk Management strategies also fail.......Might it doesn't cause any harm to management but yes it is a genuine loss to employees who work hard but still left demotivated......
Let aside our soft natured and Humanity as a HR Professional, But be practical if the company has no enough funds do you think you can survive in the market by paying salaries to employees and with no Return On Investment.
Being Professional & Practical is very good but "HR" itself means Human Resources and it's setup in the company is not just for company but for employees well....HR people are also known as trust worthy people......HR acts as a bridge between the Management and Employees......
Why do you deny the fact that even employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks. Why are you feeling bad if the reverse is happening to them take it in a positive way. Just spread a rumour that the company is not profitable and you will see by next payroll you would be calculating final settlements to atleast 50% of the employees.
I agree with you on this point that "employees cold heartedly ditch the Company and go to competitors for better perks" but in this situation HR do also take the hard ways to crack it off.....I am not criticizing HR Community but there are HR's who make false promises to fill the position and plays with an employee future.....Infact in this Website only you may find several issues relating to that......
Yes I admit that its recruitment costs but that should be planned well in advance backed by good mid and senior level management strategy
Thanks to you atleast you agree at some point......
.
I hope I have not hurt the feelings of my friends and being more practical. You will understand this concept when you work for Small & Medium enterprises, where the management struggles to bear even simple overheads like staff parties, picnic or even administration costs like visiting cards.
Correct me if Im wrong But I want Shwetha to reply me.
So Dear...I am not being hurt and hope that you also take this conversation in the right way.........But by way I must say that I used to work in the India's biggest Retail Chain but recently shifted to the mid sized MNC in Delhi...but my dear friend situation is the same........
Lastly, I must say that this issue is not to raise any comment on the any said strategy but it was posted to get different mindsets views on it...............
Thanks
Shahed
Thanks
Shweta Jaitly
From India, Coimbatore
Hi,
All of us have been giving our inputs on this topic. Following comments ae my opinion.
While all of us agree that the manpower planning should be done properly, however the management might be taking all this into consideration. For Eg: from the time a deal is signed and the project is transitioned and executed on a pilot basis, there is a time lag and the man power planning takes place as per the deal, suddenly due to some crisis or unforeseen circumstances, if the deal is cancelled which might not be due to the fault of the company we are working for, we might loose our jobs. But did the company alsways have this policy of hire and fire, i dont think so.
2. The second scenario might be one of the companies which is our client, might not be in a position to operate any more due to losses, where it affects our revenue and we might have to look at either repositioning ourselves or loosing some of us. In this case there might be employees performing at 80%and the others at 90%. Both are considered to be good performers, but situations like this, the 90%of the performers would be preferred over the rest.
3. The third scenario might be that our company itself is troubled due to unforeseen external factors, so how can the company keep its operations going on? it cannot or will have to accomodate the job cuts in order to see that atleast some of the employees have the jobs by trying to get the company on track.
But inspite of all these issues, which are continuously going on the management i think never discourages any employee oriented programmes and facilities for the employees in either good or even average times.
So why are we only discussing the tough times which we face while being asked to leave and not appreciate the employers for taking care of us in the good times.
If we are in the HR profession, i think we must be able to evaluate some of the parameters and be able to take a certain stand which can be a win - win situation even in these troubled times. If not possible, then some hard measures as well. HR is not only about creating employee welfare and development related programmes, but also to be of strategic value to the organization. Always remember we are the face of both the employees and the employer and will need to act accordingly.
This is my opinion and i stand corrected if i am wrong.
From India, Mumbai
All of us have been giving our inputs on this topic. Following comments ae my opinion.
While all of us agree that the manpower planning should be done properly, however the management might be taking all this into consideration. For Eg: from the time a deal is signed and the project is transitioned and executed on a pilot basis, there is a time lag and the man power planning takes place as per the deal, suddenly due to some crisis or unforeseen circumstances, if the deal is cancelled which might not be due to the fault of the company we are working for, we might loose our jobs. But did the company alsways have this policy of hire and fire, i dont think so.
2. The second scenario might be one of the companies which is our client, might not be in a position to operate any more due to losses, where it affects our revenue and we might have to look at either repositioning ourselves or loosing some of us. In this case there might be employees performing at 80%and the others at 90%. Both are considered to be good performers, but situations like this, the 90%of the performers would be preferred over the rest.
3. The third scenario might be that our company itself is troubled due to unforeseen external factors, so how can the company keep its operations going on? it cannot or will have to accomodate the job cuts in order to see that atleast some of the employees have the jobs by trying to get the company on track.
But inspite of all these issues, which are continuously going on the management i think never discourages any employee oriented programmes and facilities for the employees in either good or even average times.
So why are we only discussing the tough times which we face while being asked to leave and not appreciate the employers for taking care of us in the good times.
If we are in the HR profession, i think we must be able to evaluate some of the parameters and be able to take a certain stand which can be a win - win situation even in these troubled times. If not possible, then some hard measures as well. HR is not only about creating employee welfare and development related programmes, but also to be of strategic value to the organization. Always remember we are the face of both the employees and the employer and will need to act accordingly.
This is my opinion and i stand corrected if i am wrong.
From India, Mumbai
Hi Siva, I agree with you as this was just one aspect of Management.........But there are companies which are very employee friendly also...... Regards Shweta
From India, Coimbatore
From India, Coimbatore
Hi Sweta,
Today our company sacked one employee. He was recruited as an Mechanical draftsman. He worked with us for 2.5months as a draftsman. But it was found from his subordinates that he has no sound knowledge to supervise them although he is 47yrs old.
Then my boss separated him from Design department and let him to join in Production group to work as a supervisor. Today, after 8months of working in this organization, he was sacked with one month extra payment.
I blamed my engineering group. Their forecasting about manpower need was wrong. How a draftsman could work as a production supervisor?
I want seniors to give their opinion on this issue.
Regards
Dinamani
From India, Calcutta
Today our company sacked one employee. He was recruited as an Mechanical draftsman. He worked with us for 2.5months as a draftsman. But it was found from his subordinates that he has no sound knowledge to supervise them although he is 47yrs old.
Then my boss separated him from Design department and let him to join in Production group to work as a supervisor. Today, after 8months of working in this organization, he was sacked with one month extra payment.
I blamed my engineering group. Their forecasting about manpower need was wrong. How a draftsman could work as a production supervisor?
I want seniors to give their opinion on this issue.
Regards
Dinamani
From India, Calcutta
Hi, Shweta,
2 days back we see the same situation result in g. noida c.e.o. killed by worker. yes in todays senario this issue is very critical and the hr role is very - 2 important. i must say that Man power planning and industry sitution can play very vital role to solve this problem. if hr can made proper manpower planning sitting with production and finance guy's may be this sitution can be minimize... this is may thinking....
Regards
Samir Arya
From India, Delhi
2 days back we see the same situation result in g. noida c.e.o. killed by worker. yes in todays senario this issue is very critical and the hr role is very - 2 important. i must say that Man power planning and industry sitution can play very vital role to solve this problem. if hr can made proper manpower planning sitting with production and finance guy's may be this sitution can be minimize... this is may thinking....
Regards
Samir Arya
From India, Delhi
Hi Shweta
If this issue is viewed on humanian grounds than it would be unfair & unethical but being a professional you have to obey the orders & instructions from the seniors.
A quote from ARMY ethics provides: "1st is your nation, 2nd is the honour,safety & welfare of the men you command, your family, friends & society comes 3rd & your own dignity, pride & comfort are always the last."
If this taken to CIVIL follows as: "1st is your Organization, 2nd is the honour,safety & welfare of the men you work with, your family, friends & society comes 3rd & your own dignity, pride & comfort are always the last."
So don't worry & take it professionally.
If this issue is viewed on humanian grounds than it would be unfair & unethical but being a professional you have to obey the orders & instructions from the seniors.
A quote from ARMY ethics provides: "1st is your nation, 2nd is the honour,safety & welfare of the men you command, your family, friends & society comes 3rd & your own dignity, pride & comfort are always the last."
If this taken to CIVIL follows as: "1st is your Organization, 2nd is the honour,safety & welfare of the men you work with, your family, friends & society comes 3rd & your own dignity, pride & comfort are always the last."
So don't worry & take it professionally.
Hi all,
We all agree that the HIRE & FIRE is lack of poor planning. This also highlights that our accuracy of analyzing the market & future business opportunity is also poor. We have failed to analyze the requirement & business growth. We see that the business plan failing every organization should equip themselves with the contingency plan in simple terms PLAN B when PLAN A fails. So that it can retain performers in the organization rather lay off.
The current situation is a trigger for all the corporate giants to work towards Risk management & continuity plan for its Human Capital.
From India, Bangalore
We all agree that the HIRE & FIRE is lack of poor planning. This also highlights that our accuracy of analyzing the market & future business opportunity is also poor. We have failed to analyze the requirement & business growth. We see that the business plan failing every organization should equip themselves with the contingency plan in simple terms PLAN B when PLAN A fails. So that it can retain performers in the organization rather lay off.
The current situation is a trigger for all the corporate giants to work towards Risk management & continuity plan for its Human Capital.
From India, Bangalore
Hello Shweta,
It sad to see good man power going down the drain but let us all agree on one thing retrenchment is a reality which we live in .It good to know that you sympathize with employees.When it come to saving the company from collapse it is the Junior most that get axed, i know the pain to well.What can be done is at least the employees should be give amble time to hunt for another job and also use the office resources to to so .This Market slow down did not happen over night it was management which failed to foresee such a scenario,They Could have planned the layoff a little bit better .
From India, Madras
It sad to see good man power going down the drain but let us all agree on one thing retrenchment is a reality which we live in .It good to know that you sympathize with employees.When it come to saving the company from collapse it is the Junior most that get axed, i know the pain to well.What can be done is at least the employees should be give amble time to hunt for another job and also use the office resources to to so .This Market slow down did not happen over night it was management which failed to foresee such a scenario,They Could have planned the layoff a little bit better .
From India, Madras
Find answers from people who have previously dealt with business and work issues similar to yours - Please Register and Log In to CiteHR and post your query.
Only Fire, No Hire Slowdown Shrinks Job Market by 20%.pdf
Dry Scotch pine Tree Fire.zip
Hire Head Hunter.docx